Re: OT Sold It!!!!!!!!!!!!

TBone wrote:

> Why is it that you seen to think that a living wage is a high salary? 
There 
> is a big difference between the two.

TBone, you fail to realize that pay is and should be based on abilities 
and not based on need.  Now, if you disagree with that then there are 
countries that believe in pay based on need.  Are they the better place 
to be?  They have happier workers?


> Once again, nuthin but distortions and bull****.  Who said anything
should 
> be handed out?  What exactly is you definition of rewards?

Basing ones salaries on needs rather than abilities is handouts.

> And that is why your company is having the hard time that it is
attracting 
> talent.

How so?  Our wages are considerbly higher than the average along with 
above average benifits packages.  We pay for high skills and pay well to 
keep such.  If we didn't, they would go to our competitors.  However, 
contrary to your belief, our competitors are having a hard time finding 
skilled workers as well.

> And how much experience do they require to get hired within this salary 
> range?  Would a college grad with lets say a masters and little work 
> experience qualify?  How about a BA?

A college degree isn't required nor a masters or BA.  Experience is. 
These jobs are not entry level.


< That still doesn't
> change the fact that the climate there is not for everyone.

Neither is the midwest, east, southeast etc.  Everyone has different 
tastes.  However, the fact still remains that the southwest continues to 
be the fastest growing.  Phoenix housing grew last month, not declined 
like most of the country has.

> They had grass lawns and fruit trees, it looked like a mini 
> Florida except for the smog that Florida doesn't have.

Florida has incredible humidity, hurricanes and flat as a pancake.  Sure 
it appeals to many.  It's a very crowded over populated state.  Since 
you referred to an entire state (Florida) and not a particular city then 
you must be aware that Arizona is far from all hot desert.  Much is 
thickly wooded and quite snowy and cold.  I'll take the wide open spaces 
of Arizona and the southwest any day over the crowded, polluted east 
coast cities.


> And even then there 
> were water issues and I'm sure that it isn't any better now and probably

> worse unless some serious restrictions have been put in place which
would 
> make it less desirable for many and perhaps more desirable for some.

There were a few years where water levels in lakes were rather low.  We 
had several years of little rain and snowfall in the state.  Levels are 
back to normal now.  During the low times there were no restrictions in 
place.  Contrary to your beliefs, there are far worse states with 
regards to water.  California, several of the southeast states etc. for 
instance.


> LOL, you are kidding, right!?!?!?!  I doubt very much that you could
live 
> "quite nice" on $45,000 there.

Thats not what I said but I know how you love to twist things! To 
correct you, I stated the median income here was 45k and most at my 
company are well above that.

You trying to say that entry level jobs should earn more than 45K they 
need and want more?

> It is so right wing of you to come up with a 
> deceptive number like the median income when that number is an
unweighted 
> combination of the richest of the rich and the poorest of the poor. 

Do you understand the difference between median and average?  Um, it 
would appear you do not!


  If the
> true cost of living well was $45,000 then you should have employees
beating 
> down your door to get the jobs you mentioned here as you are offering up
to 
> more than twice that amount.  Something tells me that to live a good 
> lifestyle in the better areas of Phoenix costs well upwards of $100,000
in 
> family income.

Phoenix is not among the more expensive cities to live in.