E Meyer wrote:
>
>
> On 2/20/08 2:30 PM, in article j50vj.11208$wG2.3708@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> "mjc13<REMOVETHIS>" <"mjc13<REMOVETHIS>"@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>
>
>>E Meyer wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>On 2/20/08 6:20 AM, in article gWUuj.16648$FK2.1405@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>"mjc13<REMOVETHIS>" <"mjc13<REMOVETHIS>"@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Tegger wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>"mjc13<REMOVETHIS>" <"mjc13<REMOVETHIS>"@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in
>>>>>news:_8Iuj.4853$0%3.3542@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>mjc13<REMOVETHIS> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Tony Hwang wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>mjc13<REMOVETHIS> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> When I had the oil changed in November, I was told they had to
>>>>>>>>> add
>>>>>>>>>"quite a bit" of coolant to the reservoir. Since the car came
from
>>>>>>>>>NM, with a spotty service record, I had hoped that it was simply
>>>>>>>>>not topped off ever. Now, three months later, with only moderate
>>>>>>>>>driving, I see the reservoir is virtually empty again. I don't
see
>>>>>>>>>excessive white smoke in the exhaust, or smell antifreeze in it -
>>>>>>>>>although I haven't sniffed it specifically for that, yet. The oil
>>>>>>>>>looks fine. I don't smell coolant inside the car, either. It
would
>>>>>>>>>be hard to spot a slow drip in this wet Winter weather. How
common
>>>>>>>>>are internal head gasket leaks in this engine, as opposed to slow
>>>>>>>>>leaks in the reservoirs?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Hi,
>>>>>>>>First I'd replace the rad. cap and see.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Good idea. I didn't realize that pressure leaks were such a common
>>>>>>>problem. I may have the system pressure-tested if replacing the cap
>>>>>>>doesn't work. Thanks.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I took the car to a local shop today. They do free pressure tests
>>>>>> (I
>>>>>>gave them $20 anyway). No leaks, including the cap. Unless I'm
missing
>>>>>>something, it has to be the #@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
head gasket, right? Assuming it's
>>>>>>going straight to the exhaust and not burning much, how safe is it
to
>>>>>>leave it alone? Any suggestions?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>The pressure test needs to be performed in two places.
>>>>>1) the cooling system, and
>>>>>2) the combusion chambers.
>>>>>
>>>>>the first is done in conjuction with the introduction of UV dye to
the
>>>>>coolant, this being detected on the outside with a black light. The
>>>>>second consists of shop air being blown into each combustion chamber,
>>>>>then the rad filler neck being then inspected for bubbles.
>>>>>
>>>>>There is a third test that uses special paper test strips dipped into
>>>>>the rad filler neck. These change color in the presence of combustion
>>>>>gases in the coolant.
>>>>
>>>> The procedure in the Honda manual online in the UK is to just use
a
>>>>hand pump-operated pressurizer with guage, and see if the pressure
drops
>>>>in the cooling system or cap. I don't know which they used at the
shop...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Your problem is NOT the rad cap. If it were, the reservoir would be
>>>>>FULL.
>>>>
>>>> Good point.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>There is also the possibility of a worn water pump. In that case the
>>>>>coolant would drip down the block under the timing belt cover and may
>>>>>not be obvious. Findinig that leak means carefully inspecting the
crank
>>>>>pulley area.
>>>>>
>>>>>Do not put this off. You WILL damage your engine, possibly badly.
You're
>>>>>supposed to check your coolant level every time you open the hood, or
at
>>>>>least once a week.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> What I'm going to do, assuming I can even afford the cost of a new
>>>>gasket done by the dealer, is to tell them to look for leaks,
especially
>>>>at the water pump. If they find none, I'll have them replace the head
>>>>gasket. Shouldn't they install the new timing belt and water pump for
no
>>>>extra labor charge (they will be providing the parts, not me) when
they
>>>>do the gasket? I'm also having the front oil seals replaced as a
>>>>preventive measure. Thanks for your response. If you could answer this
>>>>post before this evening, when I drop it off, I'd appreciate it
greatly.
>>>
>>>
>>>Seems like you're jumping the gun a little bit here. How low was it in
the
>>>reservoir? When you say reservoir do you just mean the overflow tank,
or
>>>the radiator?
>>>
>>>In normal use, the system will settle out to where the overflow tank
sits at
>>>the "min" mark when the engine has cooled & the level will rise to
around
>>>the "max" mark when the engine is hot & has been running for a while.
>>>
>>>I certainly would not spend money replacing a head gasket that has not
even
>>>been diagnosed. There is not enough info here to even say for sure
that
>>>there is a problem.
>>>
>>
>> I know. On the one hand it may be nothing. On the other it could be
>>engine-threatening. The dealer told us in essesnce, that we can't afford
>>a new gasket - didn't even quote a price. And we wonder why cars aren't
>>maintained like they used to be...
>>
>> The reservoir was empty, or virtually so, both times.
>
>
> What did the dealer say he thought the problem was?
>
> If the reservoir is empty, but the radiator is full (I'm still not clear
if
> that's what you are saying), have you checked that the reservoir itself,
or
> the hose to it is not damaged and is actually letting the coolant leak
out?
>
It turned out to be a leaking water pump. I believe the Grand Prize
goes to Tegger (or maybe Ray) for guessing that. I'm relieved. The pump
also had one frozen bolt, so I'm wondering if the pump really *was*
replaced 5.5 years ago and 50k miles ago, like th printout from the West
coast dealer said. It shouldn't have been in such bad shape - the
replacement interval is 6 years and soemthing like 80k miles...
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