Re: Carfax, Buying Used, & Craigslist.org

Elle wrote:
> "Pszemol" <Pszemol@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
>> "Elle" <honda.lioness@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote
>>> I finally got serious about looking for a second Honda 
>>> Civic, c. 1989-1997. A few observations:
>> What kind of money are we talking about here?
>> In other words, how much do you want to spend
>> and where are you located? Maybe I will have
>> a car for you.... :-)
> 
> Write me where you are located. :-)
> 
>>> -- A friend of mine convinced me Carfax was worth $35 for 
>>> 30 days, unlimited checks. For the four cars I checked, 
>>> it revealed: (a)
>>> Odometer tampering with two, with the advertised mileage 
>>> being over 100k lower than the Carfax title re****ted 
>>> mileage; (b) lying about the number of owners for a 
>>> third; it had had four owners in 18 months. Many re****ts 
>>> attest to how Carfax is not perfect, but so far it sure 
>>> saved me some trouble.
>> With the car that old I would say actual millage is not
>> as im****tant as the current technical condition of the 
>> car.
> 
> A 90s Civic engine with 100k-125k miles on to me likely has 
> at least 75k miles more left on the engine.
> 
> A 90s Civic engine with 200k and up miles on it to me may go 
> at any time. If I knew the owner and the maintenance record, 
> I might feel a little differently.
> 
> There's a huge difference in risk. This is all we can talk 
> about here, ya know, probabilities.

i think Pszemol is dead right on this one.  there comes a point where 
mileage is irrelevant and you're buying the car for the platform, not 
any one single component.  and with replacement jdm 
engines/transmissions being so cheap and plentiful, the condition of the 
original is not very im****tant - unlike the quality of the interior 
which is pretty much vital.


> 
> 
>>> -- craigslist.org has been my best resource. (Thanks to 
>>> regular poster JT for sending me there!) Ebay, 
>>> autotrader.com and dealers have turned up little. Dealers 
>>> do not like to deal in cars that do not involve 
>>> financing, so low price beaters generally are not 
>>> advertised for sale by them. Though oddly, on my Carfax 
>>> checks, there's always an advertisement by dealers for a 
>>> 199- Civic, complete with VIN. Then I call the dealer, 
>>> and the car is not there. Maybe when a car is traded in, 
>>> carfax automatically retrieves it and its filter puts the 
>>> ad up? But in fact most of these cars are sold at 
>>> auction?
>> I am not surprised new car dealers do not keep these cars.
>> The car you are looking for probably is worth much less 
>> than
>> a 1000 and takes the same amount of space on the dealer 
>> parking
>> lot as tha 20k one.
> 
> Kelly blue book puts them at $1200-2500, depending on 
> condition, for private party. Retail is usually more.

i've seen up to $3k on craigslist for stock 88-91 civics here in the bay 
area.  that's if you can find one.  the local ricers go nuts for them. 
even harder to find now that gas prices are high.


> 
> The dealers do not keep them because financing generally is 
> not done with such a low cost.
> 
>> Also, on average it will look horrible
>> compared to new cars, so new car dealer selling not old 
>> used
>> cars does not want to clutter his parking lot with trash 
>> like top down rusted 1989 honda civic.
> 
> I am sure you are right. :-)
> 
>>> -- used car dealers are a hoot! Unless you know what to 
>>> look for on these older Hondas, do not buy from a used 
>>> dealer. A fine looking Honda Civic DX came up on Craig's 
>>> list at a mom n' pop used car dealer****p. I went to see 
>>> it. Great body, engine compartment sparkled, fluids 
>>> looked clean and topped off; but no muffler; no radio; 
>>> check engine light was on; wind****eld was cracked, miles 
>>> advertised were 124k and carfax said it was in fact over 
>>> 271k miles a year ago. I am considering making a very low 
>>> offer (after telling the dealer****p about the flawed 
>>> title tampered odometer) just for the shell.
>> What do you consider a "low offer" for such a car?
>> Junkyard is probably paying between 100-200 dolars
>> for a car which can be driven to the yard... Slightly
>> less if it has to be towed. If you see a car on some 
>> dealer's parking lot than it means the owner hopes to get 
>> much more for his trashy car than he
>> could get from the junkyard.
> 
> Well sure. Fortunately Craig's List and Ebay often have 
> shells for sale, so I know the asking price for a good shell 
> is around $500 to $1000.
> 
>>> Further advice?
>> Look at your local junk yard. Sometimes they have
>> cars these old in quite good condition and you might score 
>> good find this way...
>> Of course it is junk yard, so the car will not
>> look good, guaranteed.
> 
> Indeed there is one local junkyard that buys running cars 
> and sells them. I started checking it regularly a few weeks 
> ago. Many of the cars there do not look too bad and could be 
> fixed up nicely.
> 
> I saw such a humdinger a few hours ago. 90 Civic. Lifted the 
> hood, and the first thing I always check is the coolant 
> reservoir. Well huh, the cap is already unfastened. It's 
> overfilled and bubbles are coming out the tube right before 
> my very eyes. First blown head gasket yada I have seen. I 
> ended the inspection there saying I would not risk it. 

buy it, but pay a price that reflects the problem.  engines are fixable. 
  trashed interiors and bent bodies are a giant pita.